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Dec 10, 2023, 2:08 pm
#16
TedToToe
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: London
Programs: BAEC Gold
Posts: 2,213
Originally Posted by camdentown
Er, how can that make economic sense?
If its true it s triumph of mediocre management over common sense.
Common sense suggests that, before taking this decision, BA will have run some simulations based on data in their possession.
Last edited by TedToToe; Dec 10, 2023 at 2:13 pm
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Dec 10, 2023, 2:12 pm
#17
flight125
Join Date: Jan 2019
Programs: BA Exec Blue
Posts: 86
I see USB sockets are being installed at the same time. Could this mean the joys of thinner seats? Conversely, is WiFi also coming?
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Dec 10, 2023, 2:17 pm
#18
EuropeanPete
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: In the air
Programs: Hyatt Globalist, Bonvoy LT Plat, Hilton Gold, GHA Tit, BA Gold, Turkish Elite
Posts: 8,712
Originally Posted by Prospero
Sure, an optimists point of view is BA may follow the Lufty group, and retain two cabin crew. Setting aside the reduction in seat pitch, from 33 to 30.6, the E90 is optimised for 27 rows as each row gets a window and no rows have the misfortune of a misaligned window - North American frequent flyers will appreciate this instantly
To be clear, I am definitely not an optimist here.
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Dec 10, 2023, 2:33 pm
#19
ratechaser
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: London
Programs: Sir Ratechaser Seigneur de la Patience d'un Saint (Mucci), BA Silver, Starbucks Gold
Posts: 2,536
How long till it goes to a 3-3 configuration 
Last edited by ratechaser; Dec 11, 2023 at 12:59 am
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Dec 10, 2023, 2:37 pm
#20
tom139
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: UK
Programs: MUCCI, British Airways Executive Club Gold
Posts: 1,794
Are they going to fit bigger capacity overhead lockers in the process? BACF flights are already pretty bad from a hand luggage perspective
bafan likes this.
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Dec 10, 2023, 2:46 pm
#21
salut0
Join Date: May 2005
Programs: BA Gold, AA PLT PRO, AGR, Strawberry (Nordic Choice), Marriott Bonvoy
Posts: 4,226
Originally Posted by Prospero
Other European airlines install >100 seats in their E90s and institute the blocking of every other seat in Business so in practice the total passenger count is below 100
Finnair does block middle seats for Eurobusiness flights rather than making them tables like BA Club Europe.
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Dec 10, 2023, 3:13 pm
#22
alex67500
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: LON
Programs: Mucci, BAEC, Eurostar
Posts: 3,277
Originally Posted by Bongodog1964
I thought there was an agreement between BA and BALPA that LCY aircraft had to have less than 100 seats ? If this is not the case surely BA would have reduced the seat pitch many years ago.
I seem to remember something along those lines yes, and it was also a reason why BACF wasn't even looking at the A220. Has something changed?
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Dec 10, 2023, 3:41 pm
#23
KARFA
Ambassador, British Airways; FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Leeds, UK
Programs: BA GGL/CCR, GfL, HH Diamond
Posts: 42,871
Originally Posted by Prospero
Sure, an optimists point of view is BA may follow the Lufty group, and retain two cabin crew. Setting aside the reduction in seat pitch, from 33 to 30.6, the E90 is optimised for 27 rows as each row gets a window and no rows have the misfortune of a misaligned window - North American frequent flyers will appreciate this instantly
I think North American frequent flyers - at least on aa and as - will appreciate the 1+2 seating at the front as well!
orbitmic and YacozA like this.
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Dec 10, 2023, 4:57 pm
#24
JFX1764
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Surrey, UK
Posts: 494
Originally Posted by Bongodog1964
I thought there was an agreement between BA and BALPA that LCY aircraft had to have less than 100 seats ? If this is not the case surely BA would have reduced the seat pitch many years ago.
That went with COVID
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Dec 10, 2023, 5:14 pm
#25
KeaneJohn
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: London Stratford, E7
Programs: BAEC Gold! Thanks to FT
Posts: 3,367
I thought this was common knowledge as its been knocking around on Facebook groups for a while but clearly it wasnt.
It does seem a strange move given weight constraints ex LCY ive ofteen seen a load of offloaded pax being given rheir EU261 comp and being rebooked and put in taxis to other airports
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Dec 10, 2023, 5:36 pm
#26
BJ787
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: UK
Programs: BA Gold
Posts: 532
Originally Posted by alex67500
I seem to remember something along those lines yes, and it was also a reason why BACF wasn't even looking at the A220. Has something changed?
The scope clause that meant mainline pilots had to fly anything above 100 seats seems to have been scrapped when Euroflyer was created with the subsidiary pilots being merged onto the mainline seniority list. I'm sure the resident pilot fraternity here could explain it more, I can only find references to it on PPRUNE.
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Dec 10, 2023, 5:46 pm
#27
orbitmic
FlyerTalk Evangelist, Ambassador, British Airways Executive Club
Join Date: Jun 2008
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Posts: 30,494
Originally Posted by TedToToe
Common sense suggests that, before taking this decision, BA will have run some simulations based on data in their possession.
and experience suggests that not all bas simulations have proved insightful for n the past
rockflyertalk likes this.
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Dec 10, 2023, 5:51 pm
#28
Cw novice
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 928
Will BACF be able to do this quickly though. Surely there's not that much flex in capacity to do this other than normal maintenance.
Cabin comfort, seat pitch and F&B in Y was their soft product differentiator.
1Aturnleft and RockyRobin like this.
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Dec 10, 2023, 6:17 pm
#29
1Aturnleft
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 3,578
As unhappy as this revelation makes me feel, the additional space at 2CD on the 190's is effectively wasted space. I'm guessing with a rejigging of the overall densification (which at 33") I've always considered overly generous compared to mainline to say 31" will achieve the necessary space to add the extra rows of seats. Even at 31" it would still be more comfortable than mainline.
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Dec 10, 2023, 6:28 pm
#30
bafan
Join Date: May 2009
Location: London
Programs: BAEC
Posts: 2,735
Originally Posted by 1Aturnleft
As unhappy as this revelation makes me feel, the additional space at 2CD on the 190's is effectively wasted space. I'm guessing with a rejigging of the overall densification (which at 33") I've always considered overly generous compared to mainline to say 31" will achieve the necessary space to add the extra rows of seats. Even at 31" it would still be more comfortable than mainline.
Or, rather than 33 being overly generous, perhaps anything less is unnecessarily mean or torturous
dddc, Swanhunter, BA or bust and 10 others like this.
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